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Poster: deadpolitics Date: Jul 16, 2010 8:02am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

AltheaRose has been expressing the opinion that Billy was not a key architect of the sound. Just like everyone else, she is entitled to her silly opinions :)

What was that quote? Opinions are like assholes, everyones got one and they all stink.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jul 16, 2010 1:27pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

"Architect," sure. But so was Pigpen, and probably TC as well. I'm not thinking of origins, really, or even "key component" so much as "take this part away, and it's not the Dead anymore." I'd concede that the Dead might not have happened in the first place without BK, for all the reasons cited.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Jul 17, 2010 12:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

yeah well Bill is the only one Jerry dragged along on his first solo outing. And other than Keith the only one he ever played with outside the Dead as far as I know

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jul 17, 2010 12:54pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

I'm not up on JG's solo work at all, but I'm pretty sure Phil sat in for John Kahn on (rare) occasion with JGB, and there's NRPS, too, with Mickey (and Phil very early on, I think). Ringo would probably know all that, but has wisely stayed out of this thread :-)

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Jul 17, 2010 1:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

that Phil show is an abnormality and I wouldn't call NRPS a JERRY solo project really. More like him lending a hand to a friends side project much like Crosby or Kantner.And using this argument we could call out Mickey and the Hartbeats without Phil and Bob.

I understand your point but to me the core four includes Bill. Of course I'm guilty of pissing off Pigpen fans when I say that just like you are with Bill but that's how I see it.

so answer this question - who exactly could have replaced Bill? And do you think the band was as good later on? I'm not asking if they were still a hot good band because I think so but where they as fresh and vital after the hiatus?

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jul 17, 2010 2:25pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

You'd said "outside the Dead" :-) Did Phil only do that one time? (Perhaps making up for the fact that, as I recall, Kahn sat in for him with everyone else in the Dead earlier that year at a benefit? I'm not serious about the reason, but weren't those both in '82?)

Who could have replaced Bill ... oh heck, how would I know? I'm not up on All Possible Drummers c. 1970-1994 or thereabouts. I suspect if push had come to shove and he'd hung up his drum sticks at some point the band would have come up with a few candidates.

Was the band as as good, fresh and vital post-hiatus ... It's a matter of taste, but I guess many people think '77 was the "best" year. I'm not keen on "bests," but if pushed, I'd have to say "as good," sometimes (initially and then sporadically); "as fresh and vital," no.




This post was modified by AltheaRose on 2010-07-17 21:25:54

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Jul 17, 2010 2:05pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: ain't gonna learn what you don't wanna know

During the early 70s, the Grateful Dead were extremely active in the recording studio. I could spend all day asking you about the sessions, but…

…I wouldn’t remember them all anyway (laughs).

One record that stands out has just you and Jerry Garcia, which was his first solo album (Garcia). Do you remember anything in particular about making that one?

I do. It was really fun and free. He would just have a few musical ideas — he would be on the piano and I was in an isolated drum booth. We talked back and forth. He’d start an idea and I would just come up with a rhythm for it. The whole time we’re doing this in the studio — we did this for a few days, coming up with original ideas of his and working them out — Hunter would be in the control room writing words and verses. We wrote some of the best Grateful Dead tunes during those sessions with just Jerry, me and Hunter. Garcia even played bass on it (laughs). I got a really great, big drum sound and it was fun.

I just listened to the remaster this morning and it’s a beautiful record.

Isn’t it fun? It’s amazing, it still sounds good to me too. That’s the thing about music — it can hold its gem-like quality if it’s good upfront.

http://www.examiner.com/x-15209-The-Dead-Examiner~y2010m1d3-Interview-with-Grateful-Deads-Bill-Kreutzmann--Part-3

For me, Phil, Jer and Billy. I appreciate bob and others, but those are the key 3.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Jul 17, 2010 2:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: ain't gonna learn what you don't wanna know

not counting his prominence with getting every other song or his rock star in front status, Bob is extremely under rated imo. He is definitely an indispensable part of their sound imo

China Cat, Scarlet, 1/2 step, Terrapin just to name a couple, his quirky riffs make those songs unique i think

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Jul 17, 2010 2:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: ain't gonna learn what you don't wanna know

I agree, BUT I would have paid to travel and follow those 3 in a trio. With Bob, I can't even stream Ratdog. As part of the core, agreed, and he's indispensable to the sound

Can we agree that Bill K is integral? There from the start and at the time was the "seasoned" performing pro.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Jul 17, 2010 2:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: ain't gonna learn what you don't wanna know

absolutely i agree that Bill was indispensable. Bob on his own has never done stuff i would follow either so i agree with you there although it was VERY impressive the vibe he laid down at that comes a time show i saw. Maybe the setting too ( a homecoming for me i hadn't been back to the bay area for over 10 years )I don't know but it was SO nice and such a nice change over the horrible time i had seeing " the dead" at the gorge. That was so depressing.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Jul 16, 2010 4:05pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

Finally , AR .
I'll just blot out of mind the first two sentences .
Half a loaf of bread is better then no loaf at all . ;)

Might I suggest an easy way to begin exploring carefully PITB , sans MH

http://www.archive.org/details/gd74-05-21.sbd.belkin.2597.sbefail.shnf

Good luck !

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Poster: vapors Date: Jul 16, 2010 5:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

Great suggestion. Listening to this Playin’ surely demonstrates how the ‘core four’ are hard wired together. They got that way by playing together, taking chances together, working together to deliver highly satisfying music. Each is integral to the whole.

Billy’s playing sure butters my bread!

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Jul 16, 2010 5:43pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

Oy vay. I think I'll just pay my $150 for a Re-elect Barbara Boxer private concert ticket and go ask Phil and Bob themselves. I'll be sure to report what Their Surviving Corenesses say.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Jul 16, 2010 5:55pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Billy Kreutzmann

That would be a cruel and unusual assignment on some levels . A bridge to far , AR . Enjoy that PITB .

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